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RE: [Full-Disclosure] Knocking Microsoft
From: joe (mvpjoeware.net)
Date: Sat Feb 28 2004 - 09:23:40 CST
I think you mistake my intent.
It wasn't to say, nya I have run on all of these different platforms so
there. I posted here once and several folks went off like they discovered
Atlantis when they so brilliantly went to my web site and figured out that I
was a Windows guy (way to go guys!). Basically it was to say that I am not
someone who has single OS experience and just stuck there. A lot of the
folks on this DL ran Windows at some point and ran into something they
didn't like so they jumped and went to Linux/BSD/MAC/ et al and now whine
incessantly about MS and Bill Gates with some religious fervor. Some of the
folks on the list have never seen anything but Win9x or 2K/XP and whine
about Linux and the OSS bigots. Some of the people are old UNIX folks
looking at everyone thinking, just shut the f up, UNIX is the only true OS.
There are a bunch of folks (mostly lurking) who have run many OSes on many
platforms and laugh at all of it because none of it is new and know that no
matter what they will have a job. And finally there are people that don't
fit into any of those categories.
I jump to where there are jobs available and where I currently have fun -
right now I find very lucrative Windows positions. If Linux or some other OS
starts to enjoy "serious" Global 10 use I will stop playing with it and use
it seriously. Right now it is a toy I mess around with occasionally to keep
tabs on it and if I have to really get into its guts yet versus just
perusing the source. My personal opinions aside, I make more money with
Windows at the moment than I could with other OSes. On my current track I
intend to retire in about 6 years so I may or may not have to learn more
about some new OSes and can stay focused on Windows. Also my opinion is that
computers aren't religion, they are tools. In my case, a tool to make money
to pay for things I really care about. I think this is an attitude that more
people could do to pick up. You want to pay me well to manage Windows, I
will manage Windows well. You want to pay me well to manage Linux, ditto but
with Linux. I don't care if they bring back the Atari 800, if they are
willing to pay well, I will find a way to manage it well.
All of the OS's / RTS's have issues; if you work with enough of them you
realize this and beating on them senselessly ceases to be as much fun. This
is why I indicated some of my background. I can and do beat on MS pretty
regularly for changes. I just don't do in a way that is akin to whining, I
try to target the folks who can fix the problem and have had many problems
fixed. I was one of the largest decriers of IIS and how it was running a
couple of years ago when code red / nimda were really chewing up the
network. Not saying I was the one that got MS to change but I sure wrote
enough people about the failings and why can't we even change the d*mn
header returned - we need flexibility. I have also been saying for some time
that MS needs to stop turning everything on by default and expect that their
admins learn what the heck they are doing. Make them at least learn how to
turn things on so they have a clue how to turn them off. Liking and using
Windows doesn't mean I necessarily agree with everything they do. Again,
this isn't religion.
I have played with the RSX-11 and RT-11. Didn't much like them. Preferred
RSTS/E until they came out with 9.0 which was basically attempts at VMS on
the PDP platform. Played with some CYBERs but not to the extent I would say
I knew them. Never really played with IBM Iron except for PROFS when I had
to. In 1975, I was learning about Mr. H and Miss A in kindergarten.
Take care, joe
[mailto:full-disclosure-adminlists.netsys.com] On Behalf Of Dave Horsfall
Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 12:43 AM
To: Full Disclosure List
Subject: RE: [Full-Disclosure] Knocking Microsoft
On Fri, 27 Feb 2004, joe wrote:
> And just to get it out there so people don't think they came up with
> some surprising news. I am a Windows Guy. Previously I was a DEC
> RSTS/E guy, a DEC VAX VMS guy, a Sperry Univac mainframe guy (though
> only COBOL coding on punch cards), and a Sparc guy twiddling bits on the
Ooh, a dick-waving contest... You're just a tiddler.
Let's see; apart from when I built my own computers as a schoolboy in the
late 60s, I got to use a Varian and a PDP-8 just after leaving school,
regularly hacked into IBM MFT and MVT on a 360/50 followed by CDC KRONOS on
a CYBER 70/72 and a 170/73, bummed around ICL GECOS and a Burroughs B-1700
on MCP, finally got employed in 1975 to keep people like me out and found
Unix on a PDP-11/40. Since then, I've used RSX-11/D and /M (and hated
them), RSTS/E (ditto), RT-11 (not too bad - it paid the rent and I got to be
creative), VMS (why did those jerks go out of their way to make it hard to
use?), and probably every version of Unix on possibly every bit of hardware
Oh yes, I've also fiddled bits on Z80, 68000, etc.
I remember thinking in the 80s when BillyWare became prevalent, why are
these morons making the same mistakes we made and fixed years ago?
Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.